In December 2007, members of Bastard Nation attended the Evan B. Donaldson Adoption Institute’s “For the Records–National Conclave” in New York City. At the end of the day, nearly everyone agreed that compromise legislation to restore the right of birth certificate access to some adoptees and not others, is unacceptable. Participants never heard back from the Donaldson– until June 25, that is, when we received an email from Susan Hicks, recently hired project administrator of the Donaldson’s open records project. Ms. Hicks, self-described as the lead advocate for the Massachusetts “access” bill, sold a generation of Massachusetts adoptees down the river to get access for some.
Below is our Open Letter to the Donaldson Institute that we faxed and emailed earlier today regarding the hire of Ms Hicks. If you agree with us that the appointment of Ms Hicks is a slap in the face of adopted persons and activists who have worked tirelessly for acess for all, and calls into question the Donaldson’s commitment to us, please let the Donaldson know.
BASTARD NATION: THE ADOPTEE RIGHTS ORGANIZATION
P.O. Box 1469
Evan B. Donaldson Adoption Institute
120 E. 38th Street
New York, New York 10016
June 30, 2008
Dear Mr. Pertman:
We are in receipt of an email dated June 25, 2008 from your new project administrator, Susan Hicks. The subject line of the email is: Re: EBD “For the Records” National Conclave – FOLLOW-UP!
We at Bastard Nation were stunned to read that Ms. Hicks is now the new project administrator for the EBD and that she apparently became qualified for the appointment through her work on the Massachusetts adoptee access bill. Some of us at BN dealt with Ms. Hicks during the legislative process of SB 959. During this time, we found Ms. Hicks to be extremely secretive and unwilling to share any knowledge of the bill whatsoever. She was the opposite of collegial.
Moreover, for her to state, “I was the lead advocate and played an instrumental role in changing the birth certificate access law in Massachusetts” is not something that we feel deserves congratulations, never mind a job offer. The bill is not an equal access law because it does not allow all adopted adults access to their original birth certificates. The law is a compromise that leaves more than a generation of adoptees behind without the same rights as all other non-adopted adults.
Your own 2007 EBD statement, “For the Records,” clearly recommends that every state should restore to all adoptees unrestricted access to their records. This report also recommends that state laws that do create a “sandwich’ situation” in which some adult adopted persons get access to their records and others do not, should be revisited within three years of enactment. In 2009 will Susan Hicks revisit the legislation that she herself supported?
If it is EBDs intention to bring all adoption reform groups together, then we must state up front that we do not understand the appointment of Susan Hicks to this position. Not only do we not understand the appointment, we are left to wonder at the future direction of the institute. Certainly Ms. Hick’s background strongly suggests that the institute is headed in a direction that rewards compromises instead of genuine equal access for all.
We appreciate your time and hope that you will address our concerns.
Sincerely,
Marley Greiner, Chair
Bastard Nation: The Adoptee Rights Organization
Executive Committee
Marley Greiner
Anita Walker Field
The following blog was written on September 12, 2007, by Anita Walker Field. It was an open letter to Susan Hicks and the ABC Grounp. You can find it at www.grannieannie.org. It is copied here with permission.
OPEN LETTER TO SUSAN HICKS & ABC
WHAT WILL YOU TELL THE “BLACKLISTED ONES?”
The Massachusetts Committee of ABC was one of the prime supporters of SB 63. I have read over your webpage and discovered that something very important is totally missing from ABC’s laundry list of superlatives about SB 63. The missing link is your feelings and attitudes toward the “Blacklisted Ones” – you know, the adopted men and women who happened to have been born on the politically incorrect dates between July 17, 1974 and December 31, 2007. What do you say to these adoptees who will still have to go to court to get their birth certificates?
Will you look them in the face and tell them how good SB 63 is?
Will you pat them on the back and thank them for being martyrs to the cause?
Will you tell them that you’ll come back in a year or two to revisit the law and then you will support changing it to include the Blacklisted Ones?
Will you tell them that with all political issues there are bound to be scapegoats? And with SB 63, they are the scapegoats.
Will you look them in the eyes and tell them that this bill was the right thing to do?
Will you tell them that leaving them out in the cold was the politically expedient thing that you all had to do in order to get this bill passed into law?
Will you tell them you’re sorry?
That SO needed saying.
Speaking as one of those ‘Black Holed Bastards’ (from Ohio, myself,) I found the EBD e-mail from Susan Hicks appalling.
Ohio’s black hole is precisely the situation we who care about genuine open records have worked to eradicate. So when Massachusetts built a new black hole for Massachusetts Bastards, we were horrified.
It is “example A” of the kind of legislation we have fought and continue to fight against. It is, to put it mildly, what not to do.
For EBD to then turn around and HIRE a person who proudly brags of having played (to use her term) an “instrumental role” in the Massachusetts disaster shows either profound ignorance of what black hole legislation does to Bastards (something that as Marley pointed out even EBD’s own report rejects) or outright stupidity.
You don’t REWARD people who were part of destroying records access/genuine open records by placing them in the position of the Institute’s ‘project administrator’ on open records! Good grief!
Putting forward Ms. Hicks as any kind of liaison with the rest of the open records and adopted people’s community would be laughable, were it not so tragic.
It is beyond insulting.
Marley and BN are if anything, being far too polite.
Once again, EBD shows that despite even the content of their own reports, their current set of actions reflect a profound unawareness of the issues faced by, and real needs of, adopted people.
Perhaps instead of e-mailing AT adopted people, EBD would do well to LISTEN to those of us who have been working towards our own open records instead.
As I’ve said before, when it comes to adoption, and open records, we (pro-uncompromised open records adopted people) are the experts.
In the mean time, EBD does not and can not, speak for me. Certainly not if they view Ms. Hicks as an Institute appropriate ‘project administrator’ on open records.
As for those of us who ARE black holed Bastards ourselves, we will continue to speak and work on our own behalf- uncompromisingly.
Why? Because my life, my access to my own State confiscated records, and my authentic genetic identity are all not things I’m willing to ‘compromise’ away.
-Lauren Sabina Kneisly
Working for “reform” with the EBDAI is like working for better henhouse welfare with a fox. They are doing to adoptees what they did to us mothers with “open adoption,” which is throwing crumbs and hoping they will shut up. Keep nipping at their fannies, BN!
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We are on our own!
From Kevan,
A message from the Devil’s Advocate General’s Office:
Yeah, well, at least they’re DOING something even if it isn’t perfect. All my emails to the Arizona BN rep went unanswered. IMHO, BN is a East Coast club and the rest of us are basically fucked. So, also IMHO, what is the difference between what she’s doing and what BN does with it’s one-state-at-a-time approach? Both leave people out in the cold. And since there appear to be no active BN reps or groups in Arizona, why should I bother getting involved?
Here is my letter to EVD and the group. I hope others will write as well.
To “For The Records” Group:
I have concerns about the appointing of Ms. Hicks to be head of this committee, since the legislation that she is so proud of getting passed in MA leaves out a whole generation of adoptees. It is, in my opinion, bad legislation, and the person who was instrumental in getting it passed should not be heading an open records committee.
When we met in December it was understood that people coming from different points of view were invited and would be involved, and I was comfortable with that. I would still be comfortable working WITH people involved in less than perfect legislation in some states,including Ms. Hicks, even though my personal beliefs are more in line with Bastard Nation of which I am a supporting member.
However, appointing a person instrumental in compromise legislation that many activists are unhappy with to CHAIR this committee sends a message that compromise is the preferred option, not just something that some like and others do not. Her listing this proudly in her email to us as her qualification for this position makes this even worse.
I was quite shocked to see Ms. Hicks, of whom I know nothing except her involvement in the MA legislation, as chairperson. She may be a good organizer, or an efficient employee, but her involvement in the MA bill that cut off many adoptees from their records and codified birthmother confidentiality for the first time seems a bad choice to head a coalition open records group.
This is a disappointment. Are we going to get more explanation on how this happened?
Mary Anne Cohen
Robin I left a comment for you in TDB’s other blog-“BASTARDETTE COMMUNIQUE: RUSSIAN ADOPTEE BLOG SITE NOW UP
Just wanted to let you know.
You should get involved because there are bastards in other stats where their is activity who need us all.
BN is hardly an east coast organization. I live in Columbus, Ohio. The rest of our ExeCom are spread out–none of them are on the east or west coast.
The EBD needs to get out of the way.
Is there anyway we can get her fired Maryanne?
From Kevan,
No, Marley, I won’t get involved. Not until I see the people currently appointed to represent BN in Arizona get off their asses and at least answer a damn email.
Mark my words, in ten years, BN will not have accomplished much of anything else. Maybe one state more will have open records. As I predicted before, at this pace, it will take 100 years for open records in all states.
I wonder how many adoptees wanted to get involved, tried to contact their local BN rep and got a big fat NO ANSWER and give up. Probably quite a few.
And the BEST list, LOL, new people get on and this is how it goes:
NEW GUY: “Hey, I have an idea! What if we—” BN OLD SALT:”NAHHH!!!! We ALREADY tried that! Didn’t work!” NEW GUY: “Yeah? When did you try?” BN OLD SALT: “Well, we did! I don’t have time to go into detail! I’m busy!” NEW GUY: “Ummmm…ok…but what if we asked—-” BN OLD SALT: “We tried that, too! Waste of time!” NEW GUY: “Oooooo—kay…what if we wrote a—” BN OLD SALT: “No, no, no! We TRIED that already!”
People get frustrated and tired of this kind of shit. That’s why people don’t get involved.
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Marley…anyone… I have come up with many a scenario of my own in why the states are adamantly against opening records. But I would truly like to hear from the BN people what they honestly think why so many states fight relentlessly to keep records closed. I just have a hard time believing anymore that it’s solely about ‘burfmother’ privacy and/or adoptors fears of their adult adoptees reuniting. Anyone got some skinny about the real agenda/reasons for keeping records closed or as difficult as hell, with shitty compromised bills?
From Kevan,
Whatever “Improper Adoptee”. People that can’t handle criticism usually have provided a solid reason to deserve it. I’m not criticizing Marley; I am directing this at BN as a whole. I used to be a member. Well, as of this coming August I believe, I’ll be a former member.
I came, I tried, I wasted my time.
Don’t tell me to “get off my ass”. I did. I came, I saw, I got my records. What’s more, I have more than a mere OBC. I have photos. That’s because I went and found my birth family. But I had the records before that. No, I won’t tell you how. Figure it out yourself since you know so much more than I. Suffice to say, it’s rather easy once you get the hang of it.
And why would I want to do activist work in Texas? I live in Arizona. Perhaps you didn’t catch that before you started flailing away at the keyboard.
I don’t fault Marley. But, as a whole, BN does not delegate authority well, and certainly needs to see about appointing better reps in other states. In fact, I daresay there are people holding on to positions in BN who, frankly, ought to get the hell out of the way and let people who have the TIME to give those positions the attention they deserve.
Further, I noticed how one cannot make even a slight criticism of BN or its methods without people coming unglued. Really, it’s quite telling. Like I said, at this rate, it will be 100—count ’em—100 years before most states have open records. That’s why I’ve taken to just saying what’s on my mind rather than gussying it up in bullshit fripperies of politeness since I will get the SAME response. “Well, what have YOU done!?” A helluva lot more than most. I happen to know some people in BN never once even petitioned the court for their OBC. How the billy hell are you going to tell me you’re ready to confront state politicians if you have not even mastered the art of writing a legal petition?! Hel-LO! Nor have such people even taken the personal responsibility to damn well TRY and at least garner the solid proof the system does not work before bitching it doesn’t? I could write a court petition one-handed and have the blank template on Word.
So, sorry, not buying your excuses, either. I have absolutely nothing to gain or lose here. I GOT mine. You can choose to ignore the facts that BN is about as effective as NORML is right now. But unless BN wakes up and regroups, you will not see open records in most states, if you live to be 100. That is the reality.
Illegit Kid: In answer to your question, >”But I would truly like to hear from the BN people what they honestly think why so many states fight relentlessly to keep records closed.”
I personally don’t think that states in general care all that much. It is the lobbyists, the Catholic Church, planned parenthood and the ACLU who are fighting so hard to keep OBCs sealed. The state reps have a bill before them and they listen to testimony from professional lobbyists (who have their arguments sharpened to a T)and they try to be “reasonable” by compromising. What we have to do is make sure that our arguments are sharper than theirs and that we can refute their arguments. And then, at the end of the day, we must be willing to kill the bill rather than let it pass amended.
I don’t believe that it will take 100yrs. to obtain equal access but I do agree that many of the deformers who are accepting compromised bills (such as MA)are setting us back considerably. Three states in five years was a terrific win worth celebrating (Oregon, Alabama & NH)and then add ME to the mix this Jan. and things look good. Those states are solid proof to everyone that this can be done. And yet, there are deformers out there who will quickly give up their beliefs just to get something (anything) passed. This is just devastating for the rest of us because the legislators will look at what other states have done and they will often use their laws as guidlines.
And in defense of BN; there is no need to reinvent the wheel. Why not listen to those who have already been doing something for years to learn from them? It’s what I did when I first joined BN.
Janet Allen
Kevan-
(I don’t speak for BN, this is just my opinion as a BN member.)
I’ve got no clue why you’d EVER think BN is an ‘east coast organization’. Perhaps that’s just your way of saying ‘it’s somewhere I’m not?’
Facts are Marley’s in Ohio, BN’s address is in OK for pete’s sake, the first conference was in Chicago, the first state BN worked the statewide referendum in was OR, other BN conferences have been held in places like NJ (Atlantic City), LA (Louisiana), WA(Seattle), and MO (St. Louis).
BN protests have been everywhere from San Francisco, CA to Phiadelphia, PA to Washington, DC.(Among many others!) Hell, there’s even been ongoing BN related work in Canada.
At this rate, what with only one east coast conference, perhaps I, a marylander should be bitching about having to fly to West Coast places like San Francisco and Seattle! (And no, I’m not complaining, I’m just pointing out that BN is hardly some ‘east coast’ group.)
Maybe you haven’t been around long enough to have seen all that, but’s that’s the reality.
Now if you don’t feel like there’s enough of an AZ BN presence, why don’t you do what most BNers have done and step up. Not enough local BN? Volunteer.
BN isn’t some organization where someone else is going to ‘fix it for you’ we’re all just mere mortals just like you. Everyone here is just picking up their own piece and making things happen.
You want a big time BN AZ presence, work to make one. Don’t sit around and whine that no one else has done it for you.
The albatross of activism everywhere is when someone comes along and starts yapping ‘SOMEONE (else) SHOULD!’
Stop waiting around and step up to be that someone *or* don’t.
If you’re not interested in doing anything other than bitching about what has pretty much come down to THE uncompromising open records organizations working for adoptee rights, then don’t be surprised when we’re not all that interested in bending over backwards for you.
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Janet said-
I personally don’t think that states in general care all that much. It is the lobbyists, the Catholic Church, planned parenthood and the ACLU who are fighting so hard to keep OBCs sealed. The state reps have a bill before them and they listen to testimony from professional lobbyists…
In some states that may be true- it’s likely your own experience.
In other states (think Ohio this last time around) the State legislators ABSOLUTELY DO care. And in some ways no matter what we say it can’t get through. As Marley pointed out, not even one person came forward to testify against us this last time out, yet despite an incredible array of really amazing testimony from a broad range of people, legislators voted us down- again.
Were their minds made up before we even started? Were things happening behind the scenes unavailable to the public process? And/or are some legislators so beholden to lobby groups (Ohio Right to Life, I’m looking at you, weasels) that their vote was never going to go our way?
The answer is in some cases all three.
Here in Mary-land our legislators are so beholden to the ‘catholic mafia’ that we’ll probably get open records sometime AFTER the pope turns Hindu.
Of course they have an interest in keeping records closed- it’s purely a matter of covering their own asses or their church’s (and church’s social organizations) misdeeds.
Hell, in NJ, the catholic conference even basically admitted as much, saying that if records opened, they feared lawsuits! (see my blog entry here
Would that it were a mere matter of whose argument is sharpest.
From my perspective, it’s more a matter of open the states that we can- those that will listen and think, then focus on the hold outs and expose their own conflicts of interest- the WHY of why they cling to their sealed records systems.
In some cases, it’s nothing more than the use of state power to protect the guilty.
From Kevan,
LOL, thanks for proving my points. “Listen to the OLD SALTS in BN. Yeah, right, sure. Again, I came, I saw, I wasted my time.
Oh, and, no, don’t need a DNA test. Nice try and sowing doubt, but, you can’t fake carbon-copy family resemblances. Like I said, I’m not going to tell you how I found my birth family.
And, LOL, “why don’t I step up”? I hear that one again and again. I offered to several times and no one said anything. Nice excuse for disorganization. What, no bridge over the river? Why don’t YOU build one yourself!? Yeah, good answer. If you OLD SALTS should be LISTENED to as you so grandly point out, then you would have REAL answers and not a “do it yourself” answer to cover your own asses when caught sitting on them.
I’m not the one whining. You are. You’re the ones pissing and moaning about “reformers-deformers, the Catholic Church (shit, I think you read too much Jack T. Chick tracts there, kid), and everyone else every time you don’t get your way. Well, then YOU need to get off YOUR ass and damn well ASK people to step up. What, I’m supposed to be a mind reader? But, as I said, I offered to volunteer and no one replied. Don’t give me that “you never volunteered” shit.
Just like I said, no one can criticize BN without the adopto-victimcrats coming unglued and bitching and then coming up with all kinds of bizarre conspiracy theories involving a cabal of government officials and the Catholic Church. Again, get your nose out from the Jack T. Chick “Alberto” series of comics or Llywelyn Publishing poppycock. You are NOT that important. Get over yourself.
But thanks for proving my point so splendidly. The second someone criticizes the First Bastard Nation Church of the Adopted Sainthood, one becomes a heretic. Interesting how much some of you hate the Catholic Church seeing as how you’ve given BN what amounts to a Doctrine of Papal Infallibility. Have fun with that.
Again, I don’t speak for BN, this is just my personal take, but a few other basic points for Kevan-
you say-
No, Marley, I won’t get involved.
Far as I’m concerned that’s fine. I was not certainly not begging you and I’m not here to try to convince you otherwise. (I was merely pointing out that where you see a lack of someone else doing something, for others of us we recognize a hole that needs ‘stepping up’ to.)
Mark my words, in ten years, BN will not have accomplished much of anything else.
Consider them marked.
Nothing encourages some of us more than ney-sayers insisting it won’t be done.
Maybe one state more will have open records. As I predicted before, at this pace, it will take 100 years for open records in all states.
And as I pointed out, in my post to Janet it’s not as if we can just roll on in and all we have to do is do OUR work and everything will go our way.
There are others pushing back as hard if not harder in many states that have one hell of a motivation- protecting themselves, covering their own past actions, and most of all, for some of them maintaining their own income streams (guess how many lawyers involved in adoptions are also entwined with state governments- be that as lobbists or as legislators themselves?)
Then you have other ‘invisible’ factors, like adopter legislators, who while not disclosing their own conflict of interest as adoptive parents themselves vote us down every time- why? Because there’s no way in hell they’re going to let THEIR kid ever connect with ‘another daddy.’
I wonder how many adoptees wanted to get involved, tried to contact their local BN rep and got a big fat NO ANSWER and give up. Probably quite a few.
All of which assumes other BN people are not like real people with real lives.
You act as if there are paid state reps out there whose JOB it is to answer ever single e-mail every single phone call, every single everything. When what’s really on the other end of your e-mails are just plain ole people like you- with jobs, getting educations, with families, with travel and medical emergencies and everything else that real humans do.
People get frustrated and tired of this kind of shit. That’s why people don’t get involved.
Meanwhile, back in the real word, BN “old salts” are likewise tired of time after time newcomers walking up and saying ‘why don’t YOU (i.e. you people who are supposed to do this for me) do this thing?’
Which more often than not, is already explained why we don’t do in places like the BN FAQ. But many newcomers can’t be bothered to even look over the ground that has already been covered.
An example-
Newcomer- why don’t we use an “I want my mommy” (i.e. reunion-based) argument?
“BN Old Salt”- That is not a tactic we use. Go see the BN FAQ under “Is Bastard Nation a search organization?” for why.
In some cases the time and effort it takes to write the 50th person the same old answer that is already out for all to see actively takes time away from the real work that IS being done.
The bottom line is BN is made up of real people. Real people who have 24 hours in a day just like anyone else. If the choice is answer the 50th e-mail on the same thing OR spend the same time trying to prevent the next bad bill going through I know how I personally prioritize. One effects one person, the other affects many.
Which again, comes back to how we are working in a climate that requires us to take a defensive posture as well as an offensive. What gains we’ve made not only must be defended, but we also constantly fight legislation trying to do an end run on such.
The number of states open is not the only measure of the work- the number of disastrous pieces of legislation that would undermine what gains we have made is another piece of it. Not as glamourous perhaps, but every bit as vital.
Kevan said-
Again, I came, I saw, I wasted my time.
So please, by all means, explain why you’re wasting yet more time whining here?
I’ve got no idea what e-mails you did or did not send, but having worked with other organizations, yeah sometimes you get e-mails saying a nebulous ‘I want to volunteer’. Some organizations will then get in contact and find some way to plug folks in- provided they have something in the area.
Other organizations may do as little as tick off a ‘willing to volunteer’ box on a database entry. And keep that someone in mind for the future.
It all depends on what’s going on and what’s nearby. As well as how specific one’s offer to volunteer was.
Saying
“I’d like to do something, at some point”
is completely different than saying
“I’d like to help work to get a BN local organization structure going in AZ.
Do you have other AZ BN members we can get connected with to see if we can get something up and running?
I’m willing to answer e-mails, calls, etc and contact other AZ members to see if we can drawn on the AZ local pool of expertise to work to see if we could get a local webpage up and rolling.
I’m willing to work with whatever you’ve got on the ground here to see if we can begin contacting legislators to look for a possible bill sponsor to get the process rolling here.”
See the difference?
Offering to volunteer can mean any number of different things. It’s not an excuse (and again, I don’t speak for BN, and have no idea how they do such,) I’m just saying an offer on BOTH ends can be anything from ticking off a box to ongoing phone calls.
So BN didn’t live up to your every expectation.
Ok.
And you’re still here because….?
From Kevan,
LOL, still proving my points. Have fun wasting your time. Why did I come here? To say what was on my mind and watch the reactions. BN is made up of “real people”?! Really? That’s funny. I got an email bounced back as “undeliverable” from one rep.
Bastard Nation: The embittered, angry adoptee club.
You guys are hilarious. No, really, you are. It doesn’t take much to get the angry, self-righteous broadsides fired off from the Angry Adoptee Clubbers.
“We want our records NOW—-as long as it fits neatly into our schedules…”
So, Kevan,
How DO we get records open? What is your plan?
From Kevan,
Well, for one thing, in my calls to CalState DSS, it appears few people use the existing systems—phone and email—to put pressure on the “in the trenches” SS workers. They don’t hear from many people who nag and nag and nag over months about wanting records. Clogging courts with petitions is another tactic. The people doing the ADMIN in the system need a REASON open records would be EASIER for them. What I’m saying is, we have all this time to blog and how many are crafting petitions or clogging social worker email inboxes? In California, petitioning the court is FREE. To not use this great source of gathering PROOF we are denied petitions even under so-called “good cause” is truly a waste. I have two petition denials and both would raise many eyebrows. One denied my petition citing a genetic disease. Upon finding my birth family, I found the disease to be true. (In addition, I discovered my b-mom’s doctor report I got in the Non-ID Info was falsified).My second petition was filed under ICWA and was denied. The judge admits that my b-mom lists Native ancestry in THEIR—not mine, THEIR—records but denies the petition anyway.
These are the sorts of things one gathers as proof the current system does not work. Going to the government and saying, “We ant our records” isn’t enough. You have to provide proof their system, as is, does not work and, ergo, needs change.
Further, honestly, we’re all busy. But BN really needs to quit assuming people will figure out that they should volunteer and chase down people who may or may not answer emails. There are lots of folks who have great ideas. I think the BEST list is not so hot because a lot of “Nah…that won’t work…” appears there when new people suggest ideas. Instead, when new people arrive with new ideas, how about ASKING them if they’d like to do some local work? Waiting for them to volunteer is not a sound idea. Many of the great people in history did not volunteer for the position. How about putting out a call for volunteers with a person willing to receive those who answer and empower them with a charter or something to begin organizing in their state? Waiting for people to volunteer is like waiting for a politician to “see the light” and open records.
There are a few adoptees whose stories would make news if they told them. Those kinds of things get peoples’ attention. That’s the way media works these days. Maybe a call should be put out for people willing to speak out and someone with the media contacts could see what magazine or paper is interested in printing them. People don’t understand adoption until they can put a face on it. Most people are not even aware of our circumstances.
But we’ve got to be honest with ourselves first. The reason shitty CI and contact veto laws get passed is because we really don’t have our shit together. Those people making those laws are trying to do what they think to be the right thing. Many of them also deal with other child issues such as abuse and so on. That’s why so many of them have a somewhat idealized view of adoption. In the case of the California CI law, it was written by a group that handles kids in foster care. We all know why people end up in foster care. So, they are just trying to do what they think is right, even though it really isn’t. But all we can say is, “We ant our records—it’s our right”. Not always, but just saying it’s a human right isn’t quite true. It’s a government document and they can fall back on the excuse that they gave you one, ergo, you have no right to another. It takes denied petitions showing that you worked in the system and the system is broken, so let’s have change. But we have to get our shit together and get more people involved. Please don’t try and tell me we ain’t got problems. I know better than that. We have people in positions of responsibility who don’t even have a bare minimum amount of time to give the position the attention it deserves who hold on to the position and don’t admit they need help or need to step down. Not Marley. Marley gives her all. But I do know of a situation where shit did not get done and the individual responsible got defensive when called out on it. I won’t name names. But if ya ain’t got the time, then step down! Get out of the way.
I have nothing to lose or gain. I got my records. I wanted to help others get theirs. But I won’t waste time with sitting around bitching about people who are doing the best they can given the situation while we have people who don’t do barely shit but claim they’re too busy. Fine, be busy. But abdicate and make room. In fact, I think elections are a better way to go. Without elections, we run the risk of a type of personailty cult—or personality conflict. We need to bring some democracy into this gig or it becomes someone’s pet activist group. Bunches of social activism groups are swirling the commode right now because some of the upper echelon’s egos are running the show and they lost sight of the objective.
That’s how I see it. If a group can’t admit it’s problems and that it needs help and ASK for it, it’s doomed. Simple as that. The Socialist Labor Party quit publishing the newspaper they published since the early 1900s because it turned into a clique and they wouldn’t ask for help except for whining for donations. Donations are nice, but damn it, make the money count for something. You can’t change other peoples’ minds if you can’t change your own.
“””It is the lobbyists, the Catholic Church, planned parenthood and the ACLU who are fighting so hard to keep OBCs sealed.””
Thank you for your response…but the question is still…Why?? Why does the Catholic Church, planned parenthood (hmmm, didn’t think they were involved), and the ACLU lobbyists fight so hard to keep OBCs sealed??
From Kevan,
Better still, people might want to provide solid evidence it is a concerted effort on those organizations as a WHOLE to do so. Otherwise, one comes off sounding like a Catholic-basher, and that does not play well to the masses (ar ar ar—tip your waiter.)
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From Kevan,
And we have a winner! The Improper Adoptee proves my point with flying colors! Or colorful language, I should say. Rather than proving me wrong with actual documents regarding the Catholic Church, Improper Language responds with a “fuck you”.
Well, Improper Adoptee, I suggest you come up with something besides “fuck you” when—IF you ever—petition the court for your OBC. That phrase doesn’t help your case.
I am correct. When someone criticizes BN, people can’t take the heat and come out swinging. THAT is why you can’t get your act together enough to become effective for the future.
“I can’t refute your argument—so instead I’ll just say ‘fuck you Kevan’! That’ll prove me right!”
Wow, you sure showed me! Who can argue with such a talking point as “fuck you Kevan”? Shit, if that was just put into a PowerPoint presentation, we’d have open records in a week!
Way to go, Improper Adoptee! I thought your Catholic Church straw-man argument was a winner, but you went and outdid yourself. Great job!
Not wanting to get in the middle of anything here, but in NJ where I am, the Catholic Conference of Bishops has come out again and again, publicly, against any open records bill that is introduced. They write against it, lobby against it, testify against it. That is all on record. Also on record as opposing open records here, strange bedfellows the ACLU and NJ Right To Life, and of course NCFA. These are all real opponents, not a paranoid conspiracy theory. They all site “birthmother confidentiality” and RTL and the Bishops are pushing the mistaken and disproven idea that open records will cause more abortions.
I am a practicing Catholic, involved in my parish, so can hardly be accused of “Catholic Bashing”, but I am very discouraged and disgusted by the Bishops of NJ and their politics.I do think they are covering up the misdeeds of Catholic Charities in the past, just as they tried to cover up the pedophile scandal. That too is very much on record. Sadly, there is a culture of denial, secrets and lies in the hierarchy of the Church and this is clearly seen in their handling of adoption reform issues as well as in other areas. As the Voice of the Faithful group that brought the pedophile mess to light say, “Keep the Faith, change the Church”
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From Kevan,
Well, Improper Adoptee, perhaps when you stop proving me right and present a coherent argument besides “fuck you”, then you would be something besides a person wearing her victimhood like a flag. I notice how you project your victimhood: That you’re a “victim” of people like me. You don’t even know me, but you are willing to lay at my doorstep all your own personal defeats. Grow up; stop wearing your emotions on your sleeve. Maybe then people would take you seriously. If you are so willing to apply the V-word I used to yourself, you prove me right yet again. Like being a victim? Then be one. See how far that gets you.
And, as I said, the minute anyone makes a criticism, here come people such as yourself with claws at ready. Those who cannot hear criticism are pretty ineffective. Which explains why BN remains a rather ineffective overall organization.
I am glad to see someone posted something regarding the Catholic Church. Great information. So I would imagine if it could be shown the Church is influencing government policy, you’d have a First Amendment case there. You’d need to argue that in a federal court and BN members have told me they’re not interested in doing any federal gigs. So, this is how big groups—like the Church—defeat BN. BN is unwilling to entertain new ideas. If you can’t prove Church influence in a court of law, it’s hearsay or does not exist. If it can be proven, take ’em to federal court. It’s a First Amendment issue.
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And granted, we need a Federal Law like now to force all states to open the records, but maybe BN just doesn’t have the money or man power to take on that type of fight-but you hurl insults at them for that Kevin, which you have NO right too & you do not state constructive critizim either. If you are unhappy with BN procedure then swallow your pride and you start to create federal tidewaves for us to wipe out the blood line sucking vampires. As you say to us, stop whining and do something to create a Federal Law and unless you do you have no argument.
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From Kevan,
Improper Adoptee said: “I say fuck you to you because you sit there saying BN won’t help adopttes but you have the hypocritical gaul…”
Wow, I have a Gaul? Who? Vercingetorix? I though Caesar had him killed.
“STOP ACTING LIKE A FUCKING THREE YEAR OLD…”
I’m not the one screaming and shouting here, throwing a tantrum, and having a major meltdown on the internet because someone hurt my feelings. I suggest you see someone about your anger issues.
Yes, I bitched in the course of finding my birth parents. You are correct there. But I made my anger work for me and got my records. I didn’t sit pissing and moaning and DOING NOTHING BUT PISS AND MOAN. You also don’t know who I talked to and who I called.
Once again, you are just sitting there proving me right with every word. People can see for themselves that some of you cannot handle the least bit of criticism. You expect others to march lock-step with you doing things YOUR way and no other way. That’s bullshit. That’s the same shit the social services people do. Now the tables are turned on you. You are behaving with the same self-righteous “my way or the highway” bullshit as the social service people I talked to. And I’ve talked to a number of them. It is people such as yourself that I decide to allow my BN membership to expire and not renew. It’s not because I don’t believe in it, contrary to what you think. It’s because I won’t march lock-step with screamers and shouters who throw tantrums when someone disagrees or offers a criticism.
BN, yeah, they’ve done some things. SOME. You can say they’ve done a LOT when at LEAST TEN STATES have open records due to their actions. That’s less than one-quarter. Don’t hold out your hand for unearned laurels, nor rest on the few you might have.
Again, upon offering criticism, you basically tell me to shut the fuck up and get back in formation with the rest of the regiment. Well, no, I don’t play that. Either an organization listens to all its members and members have a say in the direction of it, quite frankly, sucks.
You say you’re 48 and still don’t know your birth parents. Well, what have YOU done? How many court petitions have you written? Have you gotten your Non-ID Info? Done some birth index checking on Ancestry dot com? Do you know your Social Services Manager’s email address and direct phone number? Do you call and email the guy? If not, shame on you and quit whining. Adoptee, find thyself.
And, you’re not a theologian. You don’t decide who is or is not Christ’s church. The members do. I see hubris is another of your traits. I’m not a Christian so I honestly don’t give a shit. But if you were such a good Christian, you would have better control over your anger and profanity. Pride goeth before the fall.
I could go on. But I won’t. There is no point to it. Suffice to say I launched an experiment to see what would happen if I offered some criticism. And I was correct in my hypothesis. I was thinking someone would go absolutely ballistic. And I was correct. This is a big problem in the adoption rights movement. The whole “shoot from the hip first and don’t bother asking questions later” method. No one may criticise. That will continue leading to failure.
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And we all know what the CC did to the Wamponogs..I know many Natives here-would you like to hear how Christian Catholics were to them?….
And oh yeah, lest us not forget how the CC makes it’s parishoners go to confession but CC CLERGY REFUSES TO ADMIT AND CORRECT ANY WRONG DOINGS THEY HAVE DONE TO BSE MOMS AND ADOPTEES, instead they lie and cover it up-don’t be a hypocrite is another basic of Christianity….or did you forget that Kevin?
Improper Adoptee—
I wouldn’t get too twisty about it. What worked for Kevan might not work for you. In fact, it might be something you’ve already tried.
With closed records, there are just too many variables in searching. One adoptee might be successful in court (I was), or another adoptee might just have one random piece of information they received accidentally that will point them in the right direction (I know several adoptees who found this way).
Kevan doesn’t carry the Holy Grail of search—he was just more successful with the information he had. Each state/situation is different, so seriously, if I were you, I wouldn’t get so worked up about it.
There’s not much substance to his rants and he’s enjoying the attention you’re paying him. From all the foot-stomping on his part, I gather everyone else put him on “ignore” a long time ago. And rightly so, I think. 😉
Improper,
Very well said
about what was done to mothers in the name of helping them..
what they did is help themselves to the babies for the act of selling them..
the other things you mentioned are true too. They happened to get caught finally by those young kids who had been molested for years.
I am not just picking on Catholics..is other religions too. I prefer to do without the religious part in my life…its just not right what religion has done to people.I know its not the religion it individuals that are protected by the church’s policy but if the policy didn’t protect then people wouldn’t be harmed so really it is the religion.
gale
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Improper Adoptee,
Thats why the churches have always claimed that the records are destroyed they know the lies, that the social workers or nuns told..they know that would create lawsuits and they are protecting themselves, just like they did when they moved the priests around..to protect the church and its molesters..
nuns are despicable too they were and are just as bad as the gag me.. “fathers” I mean molesters.
Gale
Improper..keep on speaking out Kevan..and his I got mine and you can’t get yours attitude is so juvenile..he needs to grow up..before he tells that to someone else who is telling their truth about adoption and religion.
Don’t stop telling it like it is if those who don’t like to hear the truth too dam bad…
Why is that those who don’t want to hear the truth want to keep you from speaking yours..is his the only important one..him and his little problem with Bastardettes?